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Stadium cash plan

9:26am Wednesday 21st May 2008

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By Dave Flett »

COUNCIL members will tonight be asked to agree a recommendation to take over repayments for York City's £2 million Football Foundation loan.

The plan is on the agenda at a City of York Council meeting this evening in which a report on delivering a community stadium by deputy chief executive Simon Wiles will be discussed.

Also included in the report is a suggestion to sell both Bootham Crescent and Huntington Stadium to fund the building of a new stadium in one of "two feasible sites".

Furthermore, Wiles will recommend £1 million of the sale value of Huntington Stadium is used to relocate the athletics club, currently based there, to another site with suitable viewing facilities.

His report has also called on between £300,000 and £350,000 to be committed by the council towards programme management and planning and development officer time from an external funding drive and central government coffers.

The Minstermen currently pay £138,000 a year in repayments to the loan, which was taken to regain ownership of the football stadium from previous owner Douglas Craig and his fellow Bootham Crescent Holdings directors Barry Swallow and Colin Webb.

Under the conditions of the loan, the £2 million would revert to a grant from the charitable body during the building of a new stadium. Wiles will therefore recommend the council consider repaying the loan, subject to legal considerations, as a way of "improving the football club's short-term revenue position".

In the report, he said: "In order for the council to make a commitment to the new stadium and to relieve some of the current pressure on York City, the council could consider repaying the £2 million loan to the Football Foundation and securing this against Bootham Crescent.

"This would be attractive because the current loan is at 6.9 per cent interest and the council can borrow at around 4.6 to 4.8 per cent currently. In addition, the council could allow York City to roll up the interest in the period prior to the move to the new stadium, thus relieving the club of a cost of £138,000 per year.

"The drawbacks to this option are that the council could only realistically recover its loan through the successful completion of the whole project and thus the council is in a real financial way tied in to its success."

Wiles' report adds that, because of the current state of the property market, only a combined value of £9 million can be assumed from the sales of both Bootham Crescent and Huntington Stadium.

He predicts the cost of building a 6,000-capacity stadium - the minimum required under Football League regulations - along with fees, inflation in building costs over a three-to-four year period and the provision of a more sustainable and aesthetic design would be £7.5 million before the additional seven-figure sum required to relocate the athletics club.

Commercial opportunities including executive boxes and fitness facilities would also be overseen by a professional management company, with the excess of income earned over expenditure incurred shared between the football club and York City Knights.

In a statement that will encourage supporters of both clubs, Wiles underlined the commitment he feels the council should give to the project.

He said: "It's clear that without input from third parties such as the council and local businesses it is unlikely that the professional sports and clubs in the city have the financial or operational capacity to bring about the delivery of the vision of a new community stadium for York.

"It is a corporate priority to have a new stadium because professional football is important to the city and we want to support it. Given the financial problems of funding a new stadium, the complexities involved, the planning issues and the current ongoing revenue losses of York City it has become clear that, unless the council takes a more proactive role, a new community stadium will not come to fruition."

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mm, Manchester says...
9:43am Wed 21 May 08

6000 seat stadium? Are you having a laugh? While we dont want a 30,000 'Reynolds Arena' nightmare, surely it needs to be 10/15,000 minimum? If we ever climb the leagues (unlikely I know) surely the board would look to attracting over 6000 to break even! The madness continues. Will this ever be built? Not looking likely.

Nomadic, York says...
9:44am Wed 21 May 08

Possibly a bit of rare good news on this issue, but as for the stadium itself - 6,000? Hardly sends out a message of ambition, more of a club at conference level, happy to be at conference level. Burton Albions ground holds 6,000, thats perfect for them, its not for York City.

Space_Cowboy, Space says...
10:07am Wed 21 May 08

Guys you miss the point. You can't build a bigger stadium if all you can afford is a 6,000 one. Surely the way forward is to ensure that any stadium design has the flexibility to be expanded in the future.

mos, Leeds says...
10:10am Wed 21 May 08

Don't the the problem with 6,000, we've only outdone that once in the last 4 years so it's hardly a major issue, provided it has ability for expansion I don't see the issue.

speaks99, Wakefield says...
10:12am Wed 21 May 08

Whilst I agree in my heart to the eternal optimism of the York fans that 6000 is not big enough, my head is asking how many times since I started supporting the city in the 80's we would have required a stadium with a greater capacity than this?? Apart from a few cup games and one or two matches in the old division 3 I can't really think of many. Also we would only need a >6000 capacity stadium in the championship, which would be a miricle given the clubs current status.

The council also have to make this proposition look attractive to gain a positive outcome, and lets face it, the councillors aren't going to approve a plan which costs them big money.

I think this would be the best we can hope for - should the council relieve York of the £138K milstone around our necks, the short term future of the club should be stablised and it may give us some funds to allow us to kick on and try and secure league status

David Smith, Crowborough East Sussex says...
10:44am Wed 21 May 08

I agree that our crowds recently have not exceeded 6,000 that often.
But we have to have suitable ambition and besides I thought that York council wanted the stadium for events such as pop concerts. It seems that revenue options would be largely limited by having such a small stadium.
With regard to future stadium expansions on existing sites, how many have actually come to fruition.
Lets aim for 10,000 to 12,000 capacity.
Can anyone advise the cost diffential between a 6,000 and a 12,000 stadium.
However lets get behind this and free some money for Colin to develop the team as both Burton and Rushden have managed to acquire good strikers in Baniff and Clare that presumably we couldn't get near to attracting.

Fergie, York says...
12:40pm Wed 21 May 08

Nomadic wrote:
Possibly a bit of rare good news on this issue, but as for the stadium itself - 6,000? Hardly sends out a message of ambition, more of a club at conference level, happy to be at conference level. Burton Albions ground holds 6,000, thats perfect for them, its not for York City.
I can count on one hand the times we have got 6000 through the gate in the last 20 years, so why plan for more than this. I would rather secure the clubs future first with the flexibility to expand the capacity if we ever climb the leagues. I can't see the sense in us having 3000 fans in a 12000 seater 3/4's empty stadium. Yes we all want to have ambition but we need to make sure we actualy have a club to support first. Fingers crossed the council back us!

Dinga, specsavers says...
12:58pm Wed 21 May 08

I think everyone is missing a crucial point - what happens to us season ticket holders who have had the same seat in the Family stand since 1991? Will I get the choice of a seat in excatly the same position? I dread the day when we move, this is just bl00dy upsetting not to sit in the same position season on season.

upthecity, northallerton says...
1:02pm Wed 21 May 08

Council members should be reminded that this situation is the result of the actions of one man- Douglas Craig.

With regards to the 6, 000 staduim I believe we should follow the likes of Colchester Utd and go for 10,000 capacity stadium, but with terraces behind the goals.

upthecity, northallerton says...
1:02pm Wed 21 May 08

Council members should be reminded that this situation is the result of the actions of one man- Douglas Craig.

With regards to the 6, 000 staduim I believe we should follow the likes of Colchester Utd and go for 10,000 capacity stadium, but with terraces behind the goals.

Dinga, specsavers says...
1:08pm Wed 21 May 08

upthecity wrote:
Council members should be reminded that this situation is the result of the actions of one man- Douglas Craig. With regards to the 6, 000 staduim I believe we should follow the likes of Colchester Utd and go for 10,000 capacity stadium, but with terraces behind the goals.
with greedy Barry Swallow too.

LEAM DAVE, leamington spa says...
1:11pm Wed 21 May 08

More to the point, are the council likely to agree to this? and where are the 2 sites?

Nomadic, York says...
1:11pm Wed 21 May 08

Fergie wrote:
Nomadic wrote:
Possibly a bit of rare good news on this issue, but as for the stadium itself - 6,000? Hardly sends out a message of ambition, more of a club at conference level, happy to be at conference level. Burton Albions ground holds 6,000, thats perfect for them, its not for York City.
I can count on one hand the times we have got 6000 through the gate in the last 20 years, so why plan for more than this. I would rather secure the clubs future first with the flexibility to expand the capacity if we ever climb the leagues. I can't see the sense in us having 3000 fans in a 12000 seater 3/4's empty stadium. Yes we all want to have ambition but we need to make sure we actualy have a club to support first. Fingers crossed the council back us!
"I can count on one hand the times we have got 6000 through the gate in the last 20 years" - are you from Boston?

Hull, Everton, Man Utd, Fulham, Man City, Morecambe (PO), Bury (PO) - there's 7 just off the top of my head from within the last 20 years, i'm sure there's a few more.

o2binibiza, York says...
1:17pm Wed 21 May 08

The other issue to building a 12000 capacity stadium is the atmosphere (or lack of it) that there will be. Bear in mind too, that the rugby club get lower crowds than City, so it will be even more apparent for them. 6000 is a fine starting point, I believe Sunderland's stadium can be added to (and indeed taken away) fairly easily should they need to.

yorkieboy, HongKong says...
1:43pm Wed 21 May 08

Nomadic wrote:
Fergie wrote:
Nomadic wrote: Possibly a bit of rare good news on this issue, but as for the stadium itself - 6,000? Hardly sends out a message of ambition, more of a club at conference level, happy to be at conference level. Burton Albions ground holds 6,000, thats perfect for them, its not for York City.
I can count on one hand the times we have got 6000 through the gate in the last 20 years, so why plan for more than this. I would rather secure the clubs future first with the flexibility to expand the capacity if we ever climb the leagues. I can't see the sense in us having 3000 fans in a 12000 seater 3/4's empty stadium. Yes we all want to have ambition but we need to make sure we actualy have a club to support first. Fingers crossed the council back us!
"I can count on one hand the times we have got 6000 through the gate in the last 20 years" - are you from Boston? Hull, Everton, Man Utd, Fulham, Man City, Morecambe (PO), Bury (PO) - there's 7 just off the top of my head from within the last 20 years, i'm sure there's a few more.
We got 6,600 last year against Morecambe.I agree with you Nomadic we should have a 10000 seater stadium if we are aiming for the 1st division (with promotion sized gates in 2nd div)and local Derbys against Bradford,Rotherham,H
uddersfield etc etc.

We could never afford to lose out on 2-3000 being turned away in a cup match etc etc.

Even then the capacity has to be able to be increased.Otherwise for me it will be showning the lack of ambition by the club and council.Take the pain and do it sooner rather than later.

stizostedien, York says...
2:07pm Wed 21 May 08

There is absolutely NO point in building a 6000 seater stadium.

Not only is it not future-proofed, it also eliminates major sources of alternative income that a stadium can generate.

What we need is a 15k stadium for both clubs that can host music events, parties, and has conference suite capabilites.

Finance is of course a difficulty, but we need somebody with a bit of real drive to take this thing, get it right and get that finance found.

yorkieboy, HongKong says...
2:52pm Wed 21 May 08

Exactly.

steve, haxby says...
2:57pm Wed 21 May 08

i have been to Burton ground a lot ,can not see the problem if our ground was like that AS LONG AS IT HAD ACCESS TO EXTEND INTO A 10K STADIUM,need to start winning back crowds and the only way is to start getting better quality players and get out of this bloody awful league,pity the council did not get involved b4 and stop craig,and swallow,

A View, Ozzo says...
6:20pm Wed 21 May 08

I want to know what the current board of YCFC get from my council taxes funding a private company.
The 'visitors come to York' argument doesn't fly as no away support bothers to come.
If the council wish to guarantee that the McGills have no interest in the new company running the 'corporate' side & it doesn't increase my council tax - I'd agree.

KNM, Tadcaster says...
7:17pm Wed 21 May 08

This may not be anybody's first choice of a way forward, but as the alternative is possibly following Halifax down the pan it should be supported. Nice to see previous posts identifying where the true blame really lies.

sypickle, York says...
7:38pm Wed 21 May 08

Im a Barnsley fan living in York for past 6 years and I've always been puzzled by the lack of backing for professional sport in the area (from the authorities, not the fans). There is big potential in this City

sypickle, York says...
7:43pm Wed 21 May 08

Im a Barnsley fan living in York for past 6 years and I've always been puzzled by the lack of backing for professional sport in the area (from the authorities, not the fans). There is big potential in this City

LibDem, York says...
7:49pm Wed 21 May 08

The committee have agreed in principle to sell the Huntington Stadium for development and use the cash to part fund a new Community Stadium. However before a final decision is taken local residents and the current users of the stadium will be consulted.
Athletics interests will be supported with a £1 million investment in new facilities probably at the University.
Over £200,000 is being invested in professional project management time which will cover negotiations to acquire a site, a robust business plan to make sure any stadium is viable in the medium to long term and to overcome the substantial planning issues which will have to be addressed (the possible stadium sites are mostly in either the green belt or are designated as public open space)
The possibility of the Cocunil taking over the £2 million Football Foundation loan is still alive but this will be subject to an independent financial appraisal aimed at ensuring that Council Taxpayers interests are secure in both the short and medium terms.
NB. The reason why a larger stadium in not likely to be built initially is that each increment of 1000 seats adds £1million to the stadium costs. The equity value of Bootham Crescent and Huntington Stadium combined would not fund such a stadium. Anything more likely to spell the end of the football club than landing it with a major debt is difficulty to envisage…. and yes at least one of the site options would allow for a significant later increase in capacity.



chris morley, Manchester says...
8:43am Thu 22 May 08

The NUJ believes journalists at the Press should be paid fairly to represent their enormous contribution to the newspaper and this website. Our members want to serve their readers and their community to the best of their ability. But they are having to take strike action in protest at a below inflation pay offer of 3 per cent. Newsquest, which operates the Press and this website, is American owned and its parent group make more than 1 billion dollars last year. The NUJ believes it can afford to pay its journalists a living wage. Management should come back to the negotiating table with a proper offer.
Chris Morley
NUJ Northern Organiser

T-Bone, Sydney, Australia says...
12:05pm Thu 22 May 08

York have been attracting only around 2000 people to the ground this year. If you made a 10,000 capacity stadium the small contingent of chanting fans would sound like a bee in a bottle.

brummie-ian, south bank says...
1:53pm Thu 22 May 08

T-Bone wrote:
York have been attracting only around 2000 people to the ground this year. If you made a 10,000 capacity stadium the small contingent of chanting fans would sound like a bee in a bottle.
unfortunately, since falling out of the League, the biggest loss seems to be in the number of away supporters.

yorkieboy, HongKong says...
2:12pm Thu 22 May 08

Surely we don't need to build in an extra 3-4000 seats meaning 3-4 million poundsextra outlay.It could be terracing for the extra capacity,which I guess would be cheaper than installing seats.4000 seats and 6000 standing sounds good to me....for starters.

A View, Ozzo says...
12:53pm Fri 23 May 08

chris morley wrote:
The NUJ believes journalists at the Press should be paid fairly to represent their enormous contribution to the newspaper and this website. Our members want to serve their readers and their community to the best of their ability. But they are having to take strike action in protest at a below inflation pay offer of 3 per cent. Newsquest, which operates the Press and this website, is American owned and its parent group make more than 1 billion dollars last year. The NUJ believes it can afford to pay its journalists a living wage. Management should come back to the negotiating table with a proper offer. Chris Morley NUJ Northern Organiser
Tell them to take on this £2million loan & I'll give you my undivided support.

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